LabVIEW subscription model for 2022

[crossrulz]

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@rolfk wrote:

Who needs a GUI? Real programmers work on the command line! 😀

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No.  Real programmers use butterflies.

[Eric1977]

I've used .NET Framework/Core as a front end solution but you need to be familiar enough with Python and .NET to use it. It was a steep learning curve for me. Look into the CLR module for Python or IronPython for that. I believe there are others but that is what I have used in the past.

[rolfk]

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@Eric1977 wrote:

I've used .NET Framework/Core as a front end solution but you need to be familiar enough with Python and .NET to use it. It was a steep learning curve for me. Look into the CLR module for Python or IronPython for that. I believe there are others but that is what I have used in the past.

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If you want to go really multiplatform you will rather use GUI widget libraries such as wxWidgets, TkInter, or QT. For each of them you can install Python bindings such as wxPython, Python TkInter and PyQT5 or PySide2.

But creating GUIs is never as simple as in LabVIEW for these. There is not this tight integration of front panel and diagram. You need to create some definition files and then reference them from your code and build much of the actual gui handling and programming logic yourself by writing code statements and referring to the references. That's the best case.

Or you program everything from scratch yourself anyways. That makes a lot of fun to adjust that little string widget just right by changing constant numbers in your source code. 😁

[danny_t]

Having spent a significant percentage of my time in the last couple of years away from LabVIEW, creating a C# GUI for TestStand and some stand alone C# applications, I found myself very surprised to find how limiting it was moving back to creating GUI's in LabVIEW.  I am constantly thinking oh damn LabVIEW cannot do this or or that. We are used to doing things like XNodes or using the .NetData grid wrapped into something or the extra non NI toolkits.

I'll admit when I first did C# GUI's with Visual Studio there was a lot of swearing until I managed to change my head space, but when you get into it I makes LV look quite dated.

[WavePacket]

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@danny_t wrote:

Having spent a significant percentage of my time in the last couple of years away from LabVIEW, creating a C# GUI for TestStand and some stand alone C# applications, I found myself very surprised to find how limiting it was moving back to creating GUI's in LabVIEW.  I am constantly thinking oh damn LabVIEW cannot do this or or that. We are used to doing things like XNodes or using the .NetData grid wrapped into something or the extra non NI toolkits.

I'll admit when I first did C# GUI's with Visual Studio there was a lot of swearing until I managed to change my head space, but when you get into it I makes LV look quite dated.

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That's some helpful feedback, as I have access to Visual Studio. Since you have professional experience with both, does LabVIEW have any strength in your mind compared to Visual Studio?

[danny_t]

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That's some helpful feedback, as I have access to Visual Studio. Since you have professional experience with both, does LabVIEW have any strength in your mind compared to Visual Studio?

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So this reply is a very personal and only applies to how I felt and feel about it.

I reluctantly took on a C# and TestStand project having never written C#, though working with somebody who had, I had pretended to know C#, and had to be persuaded to a bit to take it on. It was a big project fro me, my biggest ever, with two parts, one a typical test sequences type test station and the other a multi UUT temperature station, both using PXI racks and things like EEPROM programming and ARIC protocol. It was  delivered as working system to a satisfied customer at the end of the day.

I am trying to think at the end of the day, what the pros and cons were doing it in C# rather than LabVIEW as I wanted to do it.

100% it would have been delivered quicker,  I can program quicker in LabVIEW and feel significantly more comfortable doing so and I have frameworks and other tools in my back pocket so would not be starting with a totally blank sheet of paper.  Also as I am dyslexic text languages can be tricker. 

100% there is more information around regarding using TestStand and LabVIEW than TestStand and C#, also true for PXI, DAQmx etc, but there is enough, to get you going.

Regarding GUI,s. LabVIEW is a lot easier and quicker to put together a lightweight simple GUI as a mockup or for lab type use. It is only as you start to think about making a customer level high quality GUI where I feel the extra hops you need to jump through with LabVIEW start to take a not insignificant toll.  Again and again you see people using special toolkits or even .NET things, ie DataGrid in LabVIEW because they are not available by default. C# without out doubt require a lot of configuration that you get for free in LabVIEW but that requirement is what to me makes it a lot more useful, once you have mastered the basics. Graphs and Plots 100% LabVIEW a lot better 🙂

Configuration Control

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Yes you can do merges and diff's  with LabVIEW code, but it does not compare in any way with what you can do and achieve with text based languages especially with the built in source control hook most modern IDEs have.

IDE's

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Ever since I first started using LabVIEW and keep in mind I love programming in LabVIEW, The LABVIEW IDE has appeared dated and in need of this inspirational changes (which NXG unfortunately was never going to deliver). The power of modern IDE's for text languages is rather amazing.

So from a language viewpoint I cannot really thing of any reason the project would have been better if done in LabVIEW other than my own lack of knowable at the time I started it.

I think the strength with LabVIEW is actually NOT LabVIEW the language at all but with LabVIEW the community. 

[stevesteve]

It turns out that NI will still sell you perpetual Labview (and Teststand) licenses (April 2022), but they are not on their website. You have to hassle the sales rep and get a special quote from them; they are not cheap though.

[HB@BNT]

NI lost a lot of trust.

From my point of view NI has a chance to regain trust, if very soon an open source version of NI software is published.

Once the developers started the migration process to something else, they will not turn back!

For my part, I will stick to LabVIEW 2021 SP1 until the open source version is published.

Best Holger 

[MichaelBalzer]

Just saw this video on youtube from Joe Smith (dunno if he's posted in this thread?). Interesting to hear history and perspectives from a 30 year LabVIEW veteran user, and their issues with NI sales and support, and the new subscription model.

The video is sitting at over 20k views with almost 200 comments, so is seeing a lot of visibility outside of these forums.

[danny_t]

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@stevesteve wrote:

It turns out that NI will still sell you perpetual Labview (and Teststand) licenses (April 2022), but they are not on their website. You have to hassle the sales rep and get a special quote from them; they are not cheap though.

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If that is true I feel it make the situation even worse in my view 😠. It becomes a 2 tier system those who are in the know and everyone else.

Is this really the same NI we all strongly applauded just two, or was it three years ago, when they introduced the Community Edition of LabVIEW